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  • authored by news
  • published Tue, Aug 6, 2002

UFCW boys and their toys

From the Toronto Star:
Union uses members' money to back racer
Food workers, critics raise yellow flag
By Tony Van Alphen
August 6, 2002

Grocery store worker Justin Darmanin thinks his union is out of touch with him.

Darmanin earns $9 an hour stocking shelves at the Loblaws Supermarket on Dixon Road and he would like his union to concentrate more on improving his wages and benefits.

He reached this conclusion after the United Food and Commercial Workers union decided to put some of his dues into stock car racing.

The UFCW union plans to spend more than $100,000 annually during the next three years to bankroll veteran stock car racer Kerry "Iron Man" Micks.

The union says the partnership with Mount Albert-based Micks Motorsports will boost its profile with workers across the country and help in organizing new members.

Get the whole story.

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 6:37am

$300,000+ for some race car driver while their soon-to-be-laidoff members at Loman's warehouse are having to pay for their own leaflets???!!!

This is supposed to help them organize?! Organize what? "Join our union. We'll take your money and give it to race car drivers that we like." Gee, that ought to appeal to a lot of minimum wage earners.

Every time I think they can't get any stupider, they surprise me.

  • posted by weiser
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 6:59am

Oh, yes, yes, I'd join a union because it's name was on the side of race car.

Hey, what's the deal, did RHK Capital quit financing race cars?

Y'know, word-of-mouth about a great contract and superb representation are the best advertising that a union can have.

Is the racetrack unionized? Are the pit crews unionized?

Tying Leukemia research into the mix might be okay if the union put in $100 thousand and triple that amount was raised from independent individuals (not more union funds), but we know that won't be the case.

This financial outlay is obscene. The CAW is laying out $50 thousand to help the poor and the UFCW lays out much, much more to entertain the rich.

Sick, obscene and corrupt.

  • posted by T S
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 9:48am

300,000$ On race cars . if they want to do some decent advertising first lets show them how to support the loman boys. This is a Joke right?? we beg snivel and whine to get pittances from the union. 1 SOLID leafletter has spent over 1000$ of his own money and been reimbursed 40$ and we can give money to a race car . well we will find out this week If Fletch and the head clowns at UFCW will Ok Our plea for 1500$ for helium Ballons to hand out to the children entering the save ons, as we try, to leaflet the parents. Many try to ignore us or hold on to their children as a shield . Lets see them try to take their child past a man giving away free ballons. (Kicking screaming tantrums) if they try to go past. while they get their FREE ballon they get a leaflett and the speach. helium ballons floating around On childrens wrists DO NOT SHOP SAVE ON FOODS all around the store, floating in the parents houses for days! CONSTANTLY reminding them.. But let me guess we might get sued Illegal balloning or something. OR we spent all our money so some rich boy could play with a race car

  • posted by weiser
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 11:04am

The Star Looks like it's big in Quebec too. When they race there, TUAC is pasted on the back.

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English Canada and the US gets this:
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And isn't it sweet:

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I wonder what union represents the crew? Wouldn't it be better if the CAW represented the crew? If the UFCW represents them, wouldn't it be a conflict of interest? I wonder what the Collective Agreement looks like, and I wonder if the crew asked to join or were told to join.

  • posted by weiser
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 11:59am

Who goes to stock car races? Here are some demographics. Does this bear out with what the UFCW says their organizing objectives are?

They want to organize youth, but they dump almost half a million dollars into wooing older people.

Do they go after the low-wage marginalized workers? No they go after home owners. Do they go after organizing women? No, they spend loads of dough on men.

quote:


[Mike]Fraser, who collected more than $148,000 in pay last year, told the union's magazine recently that the partnership is a good idea because stock car racing hits the union's target audience for organizing new members.

He also said the demographic profile of CASCAR fans mirrors current members and he would be surprised if there were not stock car racing buffs in many grocery stores, meat packing houses, restaurants, hotels and hospitals.


How pathetic. If it's supposed to be an organizing tool, why would Mike Fraser target people who are already his members?

What a monumental wast of union members' money.

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quote:


Noonan said in an interview he would "prefer not to get into the cost" of the union's participation in the racing team but acknowledged it was more than $100,000 a year.

He said the venture would be "revenue neutral" because the union would be seeking sponsorships for the racing team from employers where it represents workers.


Isn't this just a little bit of a conflict of interest? The union is going to ask the employers to pay for a race car instead of giving their members a raise?

Somethin' just ain't right here.

Maybe it's time the International stepped in an trusteed Canada, or does Doug Dority thing this sort of crap is the way to go?

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 12:25pm

That's some good market research there weiser - and quick too. Wonder if the UFCW did any of that and what they paid for it if they did?

But really, even if the UFCW was looking to organize middle-aged, professional men who own their homes and earn an average of 50K a year, I would still say this race car idea is a bomb.

You don't get members with advertising - you attract members with good contracts, exceptional service and values that workers can connect with. Advertising is a business tool. So are some unions I guess.

  • posted by sleK
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 2:35pm

Jeezus!

The absolute stupidity of the people that figured this would be a good idea to "organize" workers leaves me positively speechless.

This is no different than the UA and their fucktarded hotel. The UFCW is now using dues dollars to fund their own rednecked (Brian Noonan) weekend hobbies.

  • posted by Scott Mcpherson
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 6:18pm

and just when you thought they couldn't get any dumber....remember the age old saying " a leopard can't hide it's spots".

I think we should just call this what it is and spare everyone the hardship of having to endure yet another best of intentions story. Mike Fraser and his pals felt a little out of touch with the people they have the most in common with. So they opened up the members pockets, digged in deep and pulled out enough cash to buy up the first sports team that would have them. Now they get to put on the owners team hats, sit down in owners row with all the other CEO's and feel important.

I would suggest instead of taking advice from his uncle Mike should consult with a unionist who actually earned his position.

quote:


Buzz Hargrove, president of the Canadian Auto Workers, said his union sees no value in backing a stock car racer. "We build our reputation by negotiating good contracts," he said. "That's what brings in new members."


Seems like sound advice to me Mike. However, if getting out into the communtiy is something your determined to do and you want to sponcer something try little league, or donate the UFCW hotdog trailer to local community events.

I look at this and can't help but think of Jim Careys role in Dumb and Dumber. Remember how he'd just reach into that breifcase full of money that didn't belong to him and spend it lavishly on stuff that made him feel important but to the rest of us made him look like a fool? Didn't you just love the meaningless IOU's in exchange for the cash? Remind you of anyone?

  • posted by siggy
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 11:28pm

quote:


The UFCW union plans to spend more than $100,000 annually during the next three years to bankroll veteran stock car racer Kerry "Iron Man" Micks.


A RACE CAR!!!! They're bloody wasting our money on a RACE CAR?

Well that makes me feel better. At least I know they've got lots and when it comes to the big battle with safeway/ofg and ufcw 1518 in B.C. in Mar 2003, there won't be any trouble supporting a long drawn out battle. Shoot those yahoos scared me, a few months ago 1518 was asking for a dues assessment. Geez the whole time the national is rolling in it, what kidders eh?

  • posted by lefkenny
  • Tue, Aug 6, 2002 11:50pm

quote:


He said the venture would be "revenue neutral" because the union would be seeking sponsorships for the racing team from employers where it represents workers.


After unions being criticized for having too close a relationship with employers, how blatantly insulting can a union make a statment when, they will ask ufcw employers to chip in for advertising.

I could possibly see a car sponsored by many unions, but employers.

I think this car is a crash for me.

aboutunions

  • posted by retailworker
  • Wed, Aug 7, 2002 12:00am

will it go round in circles?

1973. Funny the shit that comes back to you.

  • posted by licatsplit
  • Wed, Aug 7, 2002 12:09am

quote:


This is no different than the UA and their fucktarded hotel.


quote:


I could possibly see a car sponsored by many unions, but employers.


Well both of you hit this one square on the head! The UA has been sponsoring Nascar's Rusty Wallace in the #2 car for a few years now. For a 5" decal on the back quarter panel of the car, the UA pays $750,000 per year. This was a big issue at the last convention and election but Maddaloni assured everyone this 5" decal would help propel the UA into the future along with helping to fund a futuristic Mars construction project!A five inch decal! Mars!

  • posted by Richard
  • Wed, Aug 7, 2002 6:55am

I think the $145,000 reported for Mike may be a bit off if you count non-union income. However, even if you take the $145,000 as all poor Mike has to live on, you would expect that he would understand the return on investment from sponsoring a stock car.

I think somebody said it earlier, but look what Buzz Hargrove is up to:

quote:


CAW to Donate $50,000 to Homeless Housing

The CAW has promised $50,000 to renovate a derelict Toronto building currently being occupied by Ontario Coalition Against Poverty (OCAP) and Toronto Disaster Relief Committee activists, and squatters. The occupation began five days ago. The ownership of the building remains murky. The $50,000 is seed money, conditional on additional funds and resolution of ownership issues.


I don't know whether the $50,000 is a good use of member's money, but I do think it does a heck of a lot more to enhance the CAW's public image than pumping a minimum $300,000 into a stock car.

As for the pit crew having a collective agreement, that's about as laughable as the Howard Johnson and PBAS contracts.

On the bright side, you have to say that the $300,000 was much better spent than the $500,000 that went to UFCW big wig Tom McNutt's Webgalaxy, or the $500,000 that went to MGI Meats, or the cool mil. plus that went to Asia Web Holdings or any of the other strange things.

As for all the money that goes to Leukimia research, you would be surprised at how much of that money comes directly out of local union bank accounts. The Gala is just a big party with hugely expensive star quality entertainers. The UFCW big wigs like to hang out with the stars, so the members pay for a huge party.

There are a lot of regular business agents hanging their heads right now. How embarassing to be associated with some of these lame brains.

  • posted by no faith
  • Wed, Aug 7, 2002 8:39am

I guess since the union has the need to squander our money on fancy race cars and pretty pit crew uniforms, maybe we can shake their trees and pass the hat to sponser a WWF wrestler..maybe the Rock can be our new mascot and anyone he crushes can be "corrupt unions and slimey corporations" heck I'd pay a years union dues to see one of those big ass wrestlers and a union rep..like lets say GREG EYRE! Yup, I'm going to bring that up at the next meeting, I want my union dues to go to something worthwhile, entertaining and informative. WHEN WILL IT EVER END??

  • posted by <Loman Life>
  • Wed, Aug 7, 2002 1:09pm

I had a memorable experience on the way to work not long ago. I am driving down the freeway and reflecting on the many ways in which the union has indicated that it will not be "...going to the wall and defending the rights and dignity of our members" as Ivan put it.

Then I spot the UFCW logo on this rather beautiful rig. Triple axle 5th wheel trailer hooked up to a late model crewcab dually truck. It strikes me that this is the sponge that is soaking up dues while we at the warehouse are starving for cooperation and resources. Interest turns to anger. I realize that this is a very real reminder of the priorities of a union that is now a business.

Anger can be healthy if it is channelled constructively.This experience provided me with a boost of energy and motivation to keep going with a fight the union seems to want to keep as quiet as possible. Just check out their web-site and see how much they are "going to the wall" .

  • posted by weiser
  • Wed, Aug 7, 2002 2:23pm

Don't be so hard on the machine heads. Anyone can make a typo. Of course they aren't about to go to the "wall" for you--unless, of course, it's going to the "Wal"- Mart for you.

What they, no doubt, meant to say is that they are willing to go to the "Mall" for you. They will go to the Richmond Auto Mall, the Park Royal Mall, the Pacific Centre Mall. And they are more than willing to go to Court for you--the food court, that is.

Machine Head Motto:

quote:


If you can't write a cheque for it--it ain't worth doin'. Hand me the cheque book and we'll make it right for you.


  • posted by Duffbeer
  • Thu, Aug 8, 2002 10:37pm

UFCW likes race cars, Hydro One likes race yachts.

Public stuck with bill for Hydro One yacht sponsorship

quote:


Aug. 8, 01:00 EDT
Tony Van Alphen
business reporter
Ontario taxpayers will be stuck with the $360,000 cost of Hydro One's sponsorship of a racing yacht, the government says.

A spokesperson for Energy Minister Chris Stockwell said yesterday that although the Hydro One interim board would like to terminate the three-year sponsorship, the expense would be too high.

"It would cost more money to end the sponsorship than it would to see it through," said Diana Arajs, press secretary for Stockwell.

Arajs said the government will not be renewing the sponsorship for the 40-foot yacht when it expires.

Her comments come after Stockwell told the Legislature in May that the "yacht will go" as opposition MPPs hammered the government on executive compensation and spending at the giant public power transmission company.

Sean Conway, Liberal co-energy critic, said yesterday Stockwell clearly suggested the government wanted an immediate end to the "extravagant" spending at Hydro One, including the yacht sponsorship.

Former Hydro One president and chief executive officer Eleanor Clitheroe, who is an avid sailor, approved the sponsorship of the yacht.

Hydro One's interim board fired Clitheroe last month over what chairman Glen Wright called "inappropriate" expenses.

They included $330,000 for limousine services during the last three years, $174,000 for a new auto annually, a $40,000 car allowance every year, a $40,000 home renovation by a Hydro One contractor - which she later repaid - and thousands of dollars in club memberships.

As CEO, Clitheroe received $2.2 million annually and had a provision for $6.6 million in severance under certain conditions.

Clitheroe, a former deputy minister of finance, said Hydro One approved all her expenses and she plans to sue the utility for wrongful dismissal.

The Hydro One board resigned in May after the government, the utility's shareholder, ordered a rollback in compensation for executives. The government replaced the directors with an interim board.

Hydro One defended the sponsorship of the racing yacht, called Defiant, after public revelations about it this spring.

The utility said the sponsorship would raise the company's profile while moving from a public utility into a privately owned corporation in a deregulated industry. The government has shelved its plans since then to spinoff Hydro One.

Opposition MPPs called the yacht sponsorship "outrageous," a waste of taxpayer's money and indicative of a utility whose spending was out of control.

Stockwell, who was unavailable for comment yesterday, agreed at the time that the government and public utility should not have been involved in sponsorship of a yacht.

Arajs said the government has instructed the Hydro One board to review all sponsorships. Hydro One spends about $1 million annually on sponsorship of various events.


  • posted by remote viewer
  • Fri, Aug 9, 2002 8:31am

This is a great comparison Duffbeer.

I'd like to hear the UFCW to tell us how Hydro One's sponsorship of a yacht using taxpayers' dollars differs from the UFCW's sponsorship of a race car using members' dollars.

UFCW communications wizards: Now's your opportunity to shine!

  • posted by weiser
  • Fri, Aug 9, 2002 11:28am

At least Hydro can say:

a) We are selling a product.
b) We are heading into a competitive business environment.

The UFCW is treating unionism as a commodity. They've put it in the same category as cigarettes, tires and motor oil.

The data show that motor-sport fans have a high degree of brand loyalty. Mike Fraser seems to be saying that he's done his marketing research and that people will buy the UFCW or stay with the UFCW because of "brand loyalty." People will buy a union because they are familiar with the name.

What Mike fails to realize is that even though enormous amounts of advertising can get lots of people to try a product, if the quality isn't there, the sales disappear once the advertising is pulled back.

What's really odd about the stock car fiasco is that it's not a big womens' sport, nor is it big with the immigrant population, likwise, its a sport that's financially out of reach to the working poor.

Aren't these the very groups that Mike Fraser says need representation?

What's even sadder, is that the UFCW got some of the money to spend from the working poor. They got it from single moms who work for or near minimum wage in low hour jobs. They got it from immigrants who will never be able to afford to see stock-car racing. How many of those people could afford two-days take-home pay to see #02 at the Indy 500 in Vancouver?

Hydro One charges for a product, the UFCW is supposed to collect dues to meet operating costs. The UFCW is supposed to be a Union. Hydro One is supposed to be a business.

Mike Fraser, give your head a shake and look at who your members are and what they see as important.

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Wed, Aug 14, 2002 7:09pm

Oh look! Former Hydro One CEO Eleanor Clitheroe now has something more in common with the UFCW. She's suing people who've been critical of her.

And get this! Here's something really special. She's claiming that recent legislation requiring a rollback of exhorbitant executive salaries at the publicly funded utility is a violation of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. I've looked high and low and can't seem to find anything in our constitution about arrogant, overpaid, self-serving lunks having a right to be at the trough. Now, not even the UFCW lunks have gone quite that far yet.

  • posted by Scott Mcpherson
  • Wed, Aug 14, 2002 8:35pm

quote:


People will buy a union because they are familiar with the name.


and I thought only employers could buy a union

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 5:38am

Today's Toronto Star carries to letter to the editor from none other than UFCW Canada Director Michael Fraser. Mike takes strong exception to the racing car story. He calls it inaccurate and chastizes the reporter for sloppy research. Not surprisingly, Buzz Hargrove's name comes up.

Here's a not-too-cryptic comment:

quote:


The Star was less interested in getting the facts than it was in manufacturing controversy is revealed by its soliciting remarks on this subject from CAW president Buzz Hargrove, who chose not to mention that his union also supports charities and other non-profit organizations, such as the United Way and the Ontario Coalition Against Poverty.


Yes, yes, it's all Buzz's fault that you've got yourself some bad press isn't it Mike. The media is "manufacturing controversy" again. Is the UFCW going to sue the Toronto Star like it's suing this web site? Why not big guy?

Anyway, moving along: The letters section also contains a letter from the CEO of the Leukemia Research Fund of Canada, similarly chastizing the Star for its unfair coverage. Says, CEO Rudy Putns:

quote:


UFCW leaders have also recruited to our cause many of the major companies they deal with, such as Loblaws. Dozens of sports organizations, athletes and entertainers (the Maple Leafs, Raptors, Argonauts, Donovan Bailey, Laurie Kane, Eric Lindros, Mike Bullard, Blue Rodeo and George Chuvalo among them) have donated their time to assist UFCW's fundraising efforts, always out of the public spotlight. Indeed, to our knowledge, the only time in 18 years The Star has ever reported on this union's remarkably effective charitable activities was to repeat a handful of negative views of its latest leukemia research fundraising effort.


Well Rudy, I suppose it's nice that the UFCW really shines when it comes to rubbing elbows with the rich and the famous, but what's it done for its members lately? We invite you to check out the "handful of negative views" on this web site.

I would encourage any of you reformers out there to share your views about the magnanimous UFCW with The Toronto Star and the Leukemia Research Fund.

Contact info for The Star:

quote:


Send your contributions to Letters to the Editor via email to lettertoed@thestar.ca; via fax to 416 869 4322 or mail One Yonge Street, Toronto, Ontario, M5E 1E6. Letters must include full name, address, phone numbers of sender. Street names and phone numbers will not be published. We reserve the right to edit letters, which typically run 50-300 words. Photos are welcome.


Or tell Mr. Putns at the Leukemia Research Fund what you think of his #1 donors. You can get his attention at:

936 The East Mall, Toronto, ON M9B 6J9
Fax: 416-661-7799
Email: administration@leukemia.ca

  • posted by siggy
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 6:39am

Well I'm afraid I'll have to agree with Mike, ufcw certainly did get bad press on this one.

If the Toronto Star hadn't pressed it, the bad thing ufcw did would have gone more as planned.

Go get 'em Mike. Make them stop talking, you can do it!

  • posted by HJFinnamore
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 8:57am

I've read both Mr. Van Alphen's very accurate August 6, article, 'Union Uses Members' Money to Back Racer, and UFCW Canada Director Mike Fraser's incredulous August 15, response in the Star's letters section. On the same page, Rudy Putns', the Chief Executive Officer Leukemia Research Fund, bleats his self-serving defense of the UFCW.

While Mr. Putns letter draws more attention to his organization than the Star article did, in my opinion, it seems to have less to do with protecting the integrity of the Leukemia Research Fund than it does for spraying fox scent to distract the hounds from the real chase.

As for Mike Fraser saying that Mr. Van Alphen didn't get his story straight, I say Mr. Van Alphen was not only accurate, but he gave the UFCW through its representative Brian Noonan ample opportunity to comment. Noonan supposedly did the deal, but apparently, Mike Fraser is the only one competent enough to tell it like it is. However, as much as Mike Fraser does his usual cawing about the media's unfairness toward his union, he seems to totally dismisses the fact that his own words were quoted in the article and so were excerpts from official UFCW publications.

I believe if one checks, a huge chunk of all the money donated to leukemia research comes from local union bank accounts rather than individual contributions from members and citizens. Sure some locals put on Leukemia fundraisers, but they are not where the big bucks come from.

I know all too well about the lavish Leukemia fundraisers attended by the UFCW elite and their hand-picked friends who get to rub elbows with handsomely-paid stars. I've seen banquet tables paid for by local unions. The UFCW elite jet to these garish bon fetes and stay in the finest of hotels all paid for by union members.

However, that's all beside the point. The story wasn't about leukemia research. It was about a union spending an enormous whack of dough, so huge and seemingly embarrassing that the UFCW won't publicly reveal the true amount.

Until the Star picked up the fiasco, the UFCW was boasting that the deal was mainly about organizing new members. Now they try to spin the story into the debacle being purely a charitable undertaking-one that can be cancelled if goals aren't met.

Give me a break! If it was a charitable undertaking, why the heck isn't Leukemia Research Fund plastered all over the damned car? Nowhere on that car uniforms or transport equipment can you find anything about leukemia research.

Hey Mike, I dare you to take all the reference to UFCW off the damned car and replace it all with Leukemia Research Fund.

Would it be able to attract an extra couple of hundred thousand to the "Fund" over the course of a year to cover off the costs of car, driver, parts, equipment, travel, etc., etc.?

  • posted by siggy
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 6:24pm

quote:


Buzz Hargrove, who chose not to mention that his union also supports charities and other non-profit organizations, such as the United Way and the Ontario Coalition Against Poverty.


How the hell does that make an argument mike?

ufcw sponsored a race car with our money. CAW supports charity without camoflage, rhetoric or facades.

  • posted by Fisher
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 7:04pm

HJFinnamore:

Man are you out of touch with reality, promoting our union and a good cause at the cost of two pennies per-member per-year, good deal fool, it all depends on the way you look at things. Your statement " I know all too well about the lavish Leukemia fundraisers" and the implication that it is for the union elite is a slap in the face of members who donate time and effort in this worthy cause through fund-raising campaigns and as a result are invited to attend, you sound very much like a disgruntled ex-employee of the union, is this true and if so what precipitated your termination? I have heard one side, what's yours? The cooperate world spends millions in public relations all in the name of covering their oppressive labour philosophy and now when unions want to promote both a worthy cause and our democratic nature for pennies a member you scream foul. When the CLC had you escorted from the convention floor for spouting anti-organised-Labour bullshit a light should have come on in your head. Unions only become strong in numbers and anything that negatively effects those numbers attacks the protections of all rank-and-file members. If the current one-man-one-vote delegate style of organized Labour bothers you than how else can we as UFCW members deal with a membership of over five hundred thousand, a pension fund worth over one billion dollars, and the differing regional, economic, and employer related concerns of the members efficiently. And don't give me that old bottom up power source smoke and mirrors, it is time to take your head out of your ass and talk real life. You see my unit is under attack by a group who feels ninety members can, without strike pay, competent legal assistance, or a equal pension plan replace my union and I am tired of the ketch frasses that sound good but mean nothing.

Fisher

  • posted by HJFinnamore
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 9:11pm

My story is on the site, Fisher.

I was fired after I launched three law suits against UFCW officials and demanded a forensic audit of one Fund Trust.

You don't know the difference between a sack of potatoes and a bag of doorknobs when it comes to how the UFCW operates.

I in no way took a shot at the Power Source who work damned hard putting on some of the fundraisers. However, how many of them get to party with the stars? How many of them get free tickets to the gala? How many of them get free jet trips and free hotel stays?

Fisher, you know damned well that the half mil for a race car is a stupid waste of money. The people that the UFCW says it's targeting aren't in the demographics for stock car racing.

Fisher, I've read some of your stuff, and some days you seem like you have half a brain, and some days, like today, you're like a blind man in a stupor.

The reason why I'm taking personal shots at you is because you took the time to insinuate that I did something wrong when I left the UFCW.

If I was so wrong, why was I still receiving money until late 1999 and why was Workplace Strategies still doing work for the UFCW long after I left in 1995?

Rest assured that the buggers attack my charachter and motives because they are damned afraid of what I know and what I might say.

Get a life, Fisher.

  • posted by retailworker
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 9:39pm

Fishers gone and opened up a whole can of worms here, but it looks like he's fallen hook line and sinker for the bait the UFCW's trolling.

Now some folks are susceptible to the spin on that reel, but there's others thinkin that the catch needs to packed down with a whole lot more ice, elsewise it's liable to raise an awful stink, cause any sucker that'd run up on that hook must've been sick or rotten to begin with.

edit: I was fixin to say more, but I reconsiderated.

  • posted by siggy
  • Thu, Aug 15, 2002 9:46pm

quote:


I was fixin to say more, but I reconsiderated.


We be much beholding to ya'.

  • posted by BillPearson
  • Fri, Aug 16, 2002 4:23am

I'm not going to be critical or judgemental, i'll leave that to those of you far smarter or far more bitter than i am. However, i do have a story/analogy that i think may shed some light on the discussion.

Our building in South St. Paul is built on the footings of the old (please note old and gone) Swift Meat Packing plant. Adjacent to where we are is the gates (only thing remaining) of the once massive Armour plant. It was huge. In fact in it's hay days, tens of thousands of workers jamned the stockyards of So. St. Paul. After some fierce struggles,workers made a pretty good living. The unions were flourishing. Fact is, they had money to burn. Now this is before my time, but the story has been told to me by the old timers, so i take it to be the gospel.Those old time packinghouse workers were no-one to screw with.

Apparently the circus was coming to town and the elephant had died. Everyone knows the circus ain't nothing without a circus elephant. The local union executive board had some extra cash and thought it would be a great Public Relations move. They passed a motion to spend $10,000.00 and buy the circus an elephant. I'm sure they got a lot of great press and probably even some pretty good seats at the circus for the members.

Like i say, i won't sit in judgement, but the analogy is disturbing only to this point, all of those plants are gone. The only remnants are some old plant gates. Now to be fair, they aren't gone because someone on the e-board voted to buy an elephant. It's just there always has to be an eye on the future. Where are we going? and, how are we getting there?

Oh, and before someone asks, no, it wasn't a white elephant.

  • posted by sleK
  • Fri, Aug 16, 2002 4:26am

quote:


it all depends on the way you look at things.


That's correct.

Speaking for myself, the way I look at it is simply this: actions speak louder than a sticker on a car.

If the UFCW weren't such a useless union I'd have absolutely no problem with superfluous publicity stunts.

Think of all the publicity that money could buy for the Lomans workers. Don't you think that would be a more noble cause? More befitting of a union?

What would you rather read about in the paper?

A story about cars driving in a circle?

Or a story about 250 workers who get to keep their jobs?

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Fri, Aug 16, 2002 5:54am

I am really quite disgusted with the UFCW's trying to spin its hefty donation to a race car driver as fund raising for leukemia.

The article in the Toronto Star was quite clear I think: The UFCW is giving $300,000 to a race car driver. It did not give $300,000 for leukemia research. If the UFCW had wanted to give the Leukemia Research Fund $300,000, it could have donated that amount directly to the Fund. It didn't do that.

From what I can gather of the article, there is some expectation that some amount of money may, some time, flow to that leukemia research fund but that is not where the UFCW's 300 large is going - that's going to a race car drive named Kerry Micks to finance his racing endeavours.

On top of that, leukemia research is not the primary objective behind this large donation to a race car driver. The UFCW's spokesperson himself acknowledges that by sticking "UFCW" on a race car, the union hopes to raise its profile and organize new members.

I can't help but get the feeling that the union is now using "leukemia research" as a rock behind which to hide from unexpected bad publicity. If that's the case, all I can say is: That's self-serving in the extreme.

Fisher, instead of throwing rocks at other contributors, I'd like you to respond to these questions:

1. Are UFCW members entitled to question how their union's leaders spend the union's money?

2. Is a $300,000 donation to a race car driver a wise use of union funds?

3. How many new members do you think - realistically - is this $300,000 donation to a race car driver going to get them?

4. What factors do you think people consider when deciding to join or not join a union? Here is a short list of possible factors. Which of these do you think are most/least important? Feel free to add others.

- Good prospect of better wages and benefits.

- Enhanced job security.

- An opportunity to be a part of an inclusive, democratic organization.

- A greater voice in workplace issues.

- Saw it's name on a sticker on a race car.

5. Clearly union members are no longer prepared to sit back quietly and let their "betters" decide what's right for them. Given that they are speaking out more often and more forcefully, isn't it time that the mainstream of the labour movement accepted that and started addressing their issues?

  • posted by <Don't be fooled>
  • Fri, Aug 16, 2002 7:21am

Hey guys, it isn't $100,000 per year. Noonan didn't want to discuss the amount, but he did agree that it was "more" than $100,000 per year. The key word is "more".

The guys at 61 are breathing a sigh of relief that you guys and the membership think it's only $100,000.

And by the way, with a couple of more guys like that Fisher guy, we might even win the PR battle that this has brought on.

Ha! Not likely.

  • posted by T S
  • Fri, Aug 16, 2002 8:14am

Think of all the publicity that money could buy for the Lomans workers.
Don't you think that would be a more noble cause? More befitting of a
union?

What would you rather read about in the paper?

A story about cars driving in a circle?

Or a story about 250 workers who get to keep their jobs?

Right on brother! My thoughts exactly 6 weeks from the end we are still told patience. the media is not our firend. we Spend our own money on this fight then have to beg for reimbursement ( IF ) we are lucky enough to receive any. this is a collosal waste of UFCW money that could be put to far better use. If I am not mistaken tho does Jim Wells Not run a ufcw 1518 1/4 mile dragster? I may be wrong as to the owner, But maybe thats where the money for my leafletts is going.

But here is another intresting tid bit. The CEO of Icbc, a ( former) GPI, OFG big wheel, has stepped down to take a new position in Ontario after only 9 months. this coincides with the release of the core reveiw towards the privatization of Icbc. This reveiw was supposed to be released the end of july begginin of aug. and state how and why they are going to privatize the auto insurance industry. this reveiw has no been delayed till end of sept early october. the supposed meat of the reveiw is how ICBC will SELL 1/2 claim centres to private insurers along with the employees in the centres ( without the Union). IS it coincidence that the loman lrb ruling was supposed to come down early august, and now delayed till end sept, Or are the 2 linked hand in hand awaitng the fallout and prcedent setting ruling?? Am I paranoid now? seeing conspiracies or is this all part of gordie cambells selling out of BC and its unionized workers to Jimmy P and his cronies .

  • posted by weiser
  • Fri, Aug 16, 2002 9:01am

Fisher said:

quote:


Man are you out of touch with reality, promoting our union and a good cause at the cost of two pennies per-member per-year, good deal fool, it all depends on the way you look at things.


Fisher thinks that "advertising" will build the UFCW. Give me a break. Good contracts and excellent representation is the only thing people care about--not whether the union has its name on a stupid race car.

Fisher says, "it all depends on the way you look at things." I say anybody who sees an 8th-place race car as a reason to join a union needs an eye exam.

Eighth place, Fisher! Why not paint UFCW on the sides of cows in fields by the freeway? There ain't no prize for being a cow and there ain't no prize for being eighth. However, more people would be likely to see the cows. Hey, and in the end, the prospective members could eat the cow, but they couldn't eat the race car.

What's really, really, really dangerous about Fisher's thinking is that he joins the elite in his assumption that the Power Source will buy the old, "it's only a few cents per member" bull shit.

Fisher, tell me something: Let's say you have a fishboat that is in really poor repair, to the point of being dangerous, and the repairs are going to cost $500,000 to put your boat in pristine shape. And all the money you have to your name is $500,000.

Now your boat is so bad that no one in their right mind would agree to crew the vessel. Would you spend your $500,000 on fixing your boat so that people would be begging to crew it, or would you spend your $500,000 on advertising at a fashion show hoping to attract high society debutants as crew members?

And do the math, Fisher. It ain't two cents per member per year, and we ain't lookin' at a mere $100,000 per year either. The Americans aren't paying a dime for the race car. The money comes from Canadian contributions. The cost could run as high as one dollar per member per year for three years. Roll the car a few times and blow three or four engines and watch the bucks fly out the window.

  • posted by Bernie Hesse
  • Fri, Aug 16, 2002 7:30pm

Many of you comrades weren't around in the 80's when Bill Wynn (UFCW top machinehead and pig) sponsored Vicki Lawrence as "Mama" who went around to UFCW events and preached the gospel of joining the ufcw. I was at a convention when Wynn made some inappropriate remarks in front of delegates while puffing on a big stogie and embarassing Lawrence. Wynn thought if they sponsored a TV actor like Lawrence that we could win election after election and save the world.

It didn't work and gimmick after gimmick has been employed by the boys in D.C.

We are in trouble and something has to happen.

Stay tune for all the Machineheads have been summoned to K Street in Sept for a controlled retreat session.

St. Paul Trotsky

  • posted by Scott Mcpherson
  • Sat, Aug 17, 2002 1:46am

Fisher said;

quote:


If the current one-man-one-vote delegate style of organized Labour bothers you


One-man-one vote??????? I thought you said you knew the UFCW constitution and understood the inner workings of the UFCW?

The UFCW despots in Wash. D.C. need only the big 65 to run this union any damn way they see fit. They can "ensure" loyal greedy trough feeders control these locals, send them off to the International convention and each of these guys can vote for the entire delagation their local is allowed. Any members that go to these drunken freeforalls go as a reward for "loyalty" to the Pres and we've all heard about the closed door "this is how you vote on this issue" meetings that take place throughout the party. A guy in my store went to Chicago and he bragged about the free drinks, the White sox's and cubs games he seen and the tour of the city, the leather jacket etc. and during an instore meeting proudly thanked everybody for paying for it all.

And your calling HJF a fool? your kidding right? It's clear to me that if you don't understand this very basic and simplistic "loophole" in that rag the UFCW trys to pass off to the public as a constitution you haven't the slightest idea what the "real world" looks like with UFCW goggles on. Wake up and grow up.

quote:


Unions only become strong in numbers and anything that negatively effects those numbers attacks the protections of all rank-and-file members.


I agree. These guys spend the members money like a bunch of drunken sailors on shore leave. It's absolutely unconscionable anyone calling themselves "a trade unionist" would authorize [for any reason] the spending of over 300K on a stupid meaningless race car when Thunderbay employees are out of a job and most likely in need of retraining and assistance. When Loman workers will soon be joining them and Lord only knows who else. When Fortinos employees could use and extra 100 bucks a week in strike pay to win a better deal etc etc etc etc etc etc etc. I can't think of anything that has a bigger negative impact on the welfare of union members than the mismanagement of union funds.

I also can't believe anyone would be so gulable to bite on that penny's a member crap. Don't you get it Fisher, it's not their money to spend! For Gods sake man think!

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:14am

I know it's sort of against the rules to resurrect threads from way back when but there's an update on this story and the earlier thread provides some good background and comment on what has to be one of the more blatant examples of the UFCW pissing away members' money - the infamous racing car caper.

According to today's Toronto Sun, the UFC-dubya's have ended their relationship with the race car driver who received $300,000 from the union, money that was basically squandered so that a UFCW rep named Brian Noonan could indulge his indulge his love of car racing.

Here's the news item from the Sun.

quote:


MICKS LOSES UNION CARD

One of motorsports' most unique relations has come to an end for CASCAR Super Series veteran Kerry Micks.

For the past two seasons Micks' No. 02 Ford has carried the logo of the United Food and Commercial Works Union on its rear quarter panel.

The Micks team was heavily involved in raising funds for the union's charity -- the Leukemia Research Fund of Canada.

"My sponsorship with UFCW Canada has come to a close," Micks said. "This announcement has been difficult to make because our solid relationship with this organization still stands strong in regard to our continuing support for The Leukemia Research Fund of Canada."

Micks said his Mount Albert-based team is ready to race while looking for new sponsorship.

"This has definitely been a setback," Micks said. "(But) I feel confident that we can go into the 2004 season as a strong contender for the championship."


Here's a few things we had to say about the shameful episode.

When the shit started to hit the fan, the UFCW tried to spin its way out of the mess by saying the racing car would raise money for charity and help them organize new members.

Gee, I wonder how many new members the $300,000 investment organized or how much dough was raised for charity?

I'll bet the driver is disappointed in the loss of the sponsorship. He'll have to look far and wide to find another bunch of chumps like this.

  • posted by weiser
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:25am

quote:


The Micks team was heavily involved in raising funds for the union's charity -- the Leukemia Research Fund of Canada.

"My sponsorship with UFCW Canada has come to a close," Micks said. "This announcement has been difficult to make because our solid relationship with this organization still stands strong in regard to our continuing support for The Leukemia Research Fund of Canada."


I doubt if the UFCW can point to one new member who was attracted to the union by their logo on the back quarter panel. What's worse, is that $300 thousand was spent supposedly to attract money to The Leukemia Research Fund of Canada. I wonder just how much it attracted? Probably nowhere near the $300 thousand pissed into the race car.

  • posted by siggy
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:28am

quote:


"My sponsorship with UFCW Canada has come to a close," Micks said. "This announcement has been difficult to make because our solid relationship with this organization still stands strong in regard to our continuing support for The Leukemia Research Fund of Canada."


Micks comment sounds muffled - almost like he's got shit in his mouth - no?

Very gracious - friends to the end - ufcw gave you no reason for cutting off the feeding tube Micks?

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:29am

I actually think that their use of the Leukemia Research Fund to rationalize the expenditure of $300,000 of members' dues is sleazy in the extreme.

If they wanted to make a donation to leukemia research they could have just donated some reasonable amount. Spending $300,000 to raise donations makes no sense at all. The biggest donation that was made here was the $300,000 that was donated to some race car driver.

  • posted by weiser
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:47am

Wow! The donations for 2002 are an embarrassment, I wonder why they haven't shown the 2003 and '04 figures?

quote:


In 2002 UFCW Canada partnered with Canadian race car driver Kerry Micks to raise the profile of UFCW Canada and raise funds for leukemia. Through the sale of race wear hats, jackets, etc. on the CASCAR circuit, over $30,000 has been raised for leukemia research. Great job!


The point that's lost is what mandate does the UFCW have to give dues dollars away to any charity? It's a nice gesture, but if they won't take my grievance on because it's too expensive, why the hell will they spend my dues on a charity?

I'm not against charities; I give to a few of them--a couple on a regular basis. I'm just questioning how these guys get the power to spend dues on things other than member representation?

  • posted by Info
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:55am

Care to show us a unoin that does not give money to charity, I am glad to read that someone thinks it is good to give money to cancer research and others on need.

  • posted by siggy
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 9:20am

quote:


Care to show us a unoin that does give money to charity, I am glad to read that someone thinks it is good to give money to cancer research and others on need


As a ufcw1518 member I have no idea how or why leukemia became ufcw's charity of choice but it does appear to be the one charity ufcw favours, locally and nationally. I'll have to look into it, I'm sure there'll be interesting connections and it's way fun to connect the ufcw dolts..

That aside - there's a huge difference between a union encouraging and supporting member driven charity drives and handing over lump sums of member's dues to an outsider - in the name of charity - without a current member mandate. Just a little reminder - it's our money - we get to choose.

Get some sunlight info - you're fading.

  • posted by Info
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 9:35am

Sorry if I seem pale there siggy unlike you I did not just get back from centeral american vacation, that my well paying union job afforded me.

I am sure that as someone who is very conscience of people being paid fairly you used only union employed workplaces on your vacation or in lieu of that you tipped enough that you topped up their wages to fair market value.
Yeah your right it is your money that your union bargaining team got your employer to pay to you with consumers money, in a store that someone else invested their money to build and maintain.

  • posted by remote viewer
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 11:27am

Info's getting madder and madder. (Just like in his previous incarnations under other ID's)

He's angry at siggy for going on vacation. Maybe he's envious. He's sitting around monitoring the MFD site where so many things are being said that make him angry and shake his faith in the munificent UFCW and she had the unmitigated gall to go off on a trip. Wow, after all these years of working and contributing to society in so many ways, going off on a vacation (on her own dime not the members') is cause for puffery.

The troll is running out of things to huff and puff about. Watch for increasingly stupid comments in the hours ahead.

  • posted by Duffbeer
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 12:46pm

I was surprised to miss hearing about this breakup between Micks and the UFCW... since it happened back on April 14/04.

This would seem to indicate that the UFCW did not exercise it's option for a third season. If that is the case the UFCW may have saved $100,000.

Did the UFCW quietly cut their losses on this sponsorship deal? It would be nice to see an admission that the endeavour may have been a mistake if the "fundraising and awareness-raising" was indeed not as successful as was hoped.

UFCW EXIT LEAVES MICKS LOOKING FOR A SPONSOR

quote:


The brief time we have been able to spend with Micks Motorsports has certainly not been wasted,' says UFCW Canada national director Michael J. Fraser. 'We have not only made what will be long-lasting friendships, but have been received with warmth and understanding that reflects the values of Canada's stockcar racing community. The support shown for Kerry Micks in last year's quest for the championship made the UFCW Canada Racing for a Cure family one of the foremost in CASCAR. The fundraising and awareness-raising for the Leukemia Research Fund of Canada is something we hope and believe will have a lasting impact in CASCAR.'


It may be interesting to note who brought UFCW Canada and The Leukemia Research Fund of Canada together.

Third Party Fundraising [.pdf file]

quote:


In the early 90's, The Honourable Bob Rae suggested an alliance with United Food and Commercial Workers' Union (UFCW), Canadian Division, whose charity of choice was Leukemia Society of America. This alliance initiated the coming together of several small groups across the country to form one organization, Leukemia Research Fund of Canada (LRFC) in 1992.


What happened to Micks Motorsports?

Well the UFCW Racewear site is now a no-name "search" site (Warning:Don't go there without a secure web browser!) but Micks *did* secure new sponsorship.

KERRY MICKS TO BE POWERED BY POWER WATER!

quote:


June 22, 2004, Mt. Albert, Ontario - Kerry Micks of Micks Motorsports, running in the CASCAR Super Series, has retained sponsorship for the rest of the 2004 Eastern Series from POWER WATER.'We are very excited about our new venture with Power Water,' stated Micks, a veteran in the national stock car series. 'I heard about and tried their product for the first time at the Power Water 200 at Cayuga Speedway earlier this year, where I met executives from the company. Talks began that day and have gelled into a plan for the rest of the 2004 Eastern events with a possibility into 2005. We want the 2004 Power Water Ford Taurus to turn out right the first time and unveiling the new design at the Canada Day Shoot Out coming up at Cayuga Speedway July 3 and 4 will be a perfect fit for all involved,' stated Kerry.


Micks Motorsports Signs POWERWATER Again

quote:


12/5/2004 - POWERWATER Corporation has announced the renewal of its major sponsorship agreement with Kerry Micks and Micks Motorsports for the 2005 and 2006 CASCAR Super Series.
"We're very happy to welcome back and renew our support of the Micks Motorsports Team to our PowerWater family," said PowerWater's Terry Coughlin. "We're delighted to team up with Kerry and be able to help him attain his goal of winning races and his run for the CASCAR Super Series Championship."


What the heck is PowerWater?

quote:


Established in 1999, PowerWater Corporation is a Canadian owned and operated bottled drinking water company. Our premier product, PowerWater, is pure, clean, Oxygenated Distilled Water. Utilizing a Trade Secret Industrial Design, our advanced technology provides consumers with a beverage that quenches thirst while energizing the body.


Hey, where can I buy some of that PowerWater? [Warning: stupid Flash site!]

quote:


PowerWater is currently available at:

- Loblaws (health food section)
- Zehrs
- Fortinos
- and leading health food stores.


And the circle of life continues...

  • posted by siggy
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 6:11pm

quote:


I am sure that as someone who is very conscience of people being paid fairly you used only union employed workplaces on your vacation or in lieu of that you tipped enough that you topped up their wages to fair market value.


It's really no-one's business how or where I spend my hard earned cash. And it might make for better reading to discuss where ufcw et al like to drop thousands of union dollars in one sitting but that's another thread - coming soon I might add - and 'sides I don't mind sharing.

Costa Rica is not widely unionized, from what I could gather there are only a few unionized government workplaces. Minimum wage is a staggering $255 US dollars per month. The country spends nada on defense - tax dollars are spent on it's people. Everyone is entitled to medical, dental and education is free. It has one of the highest literacy rates in the world.

They tax the rich not the poor and imprison corrupt leaders. A legislated 10% tip is included in the price of service. I would assume there's room for employers to screw employees but it also stands to reason there are checks and balances at the taxation end for workers to ensure they get what's coming to them. How much did I tip - absolutely none of your business info.

quote:


Yeah your right it is your money that your union bargaining team got your employer to pay to you with consumers money, in a store that someone else invested their money to build and maintain.


Without mine and my co-workers contribution (investment) the employer would make shit. I earn my living honestly, for that I don't apologize.

I pay union dues to ensure my right under the Canadian Charter of Rights to earn that living is protected - for that I thank no-one - my union brothers and sisters and those who fought to secure that right notwithstanding. Do you have a problem with that info?

  • posted by Info
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 6:32pm

No rv sorry to disappoint I not angry at all, actually the opposite I am happy she was able to enjoy a vacation.

For me it may have been a little surprise in that she and other posters here make it sound like they just getting by and it is the fault of the union that they are in the position they are in. So I guess I wonder what people here figure they should get or what is owed to them?

And you if feel that way do you not think that those who write their oen checks feel the same way whether it be politicians union leaders or ceo's?

I have never understood greed, as far as the difference between someone who wants $10.00 more than something is worth and $10,000.00.

What is the moral difference?

I have read here how people get so irate at what union leaders make as compared to what they are making and all I can think is it seems greed leads to envy and envy leads to anger and the anger here has lead to total unreasonableness.So I post from the side of the coin that does not get angry at things,I may question a person's motives such as in your case rv, but getting angry does nothing.

  • posted by Richard
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 6:45pm

quote:


posted by Info:
No rv sorry to disappoint I not angry at all, actually the opposite I am happy she was able to enjoy a vacation.

For me it may have been a little surprise in that she and other posters here make it sound like they just getting by and it is the fault of the union that they are in the position they are in. So I guess I wonder what people here figure they should get or what is owed to them?

And you if feel that way do you not think that those who write their oen checks feel the same way whether it be politicians union leaders or ceo's?

I have never understood greed, as far as the difference between someone who wants $10.00 more than something is worth and $10,000.00.

What is the moral difference?

I have read here how people get so irate at what union leaders make as compared to what they are making and all I can think is it seems greed leads to envy and envy leads to anger and the anger here has lead to total unreasonableness.So I post from the side of the coin that does not get angry at things,I may question a person's motives such as in your case rv, but getting angry does nothing.


That's Info yammering in his 134th post. Here he is pontificating in his 17th post:

quote:


I would think the fact that the leader of the CAW is well known outside union circles speaks to the question EDelio asks,
Is he running for a seat in parliament?

But truth be told in the end the CAW depends on the image Mr. Hargrove presents, shortly after he was elected national president handlers took him to refine his look. He wears designer eye wear and expensive clothing all for the public image of success to attract people to join the union.

Remember image is everything when selling the public a product or service, if you do not believe me then ask yourself why he does not look more like the typical auto worker?


Is Info trying to sound illiterate so that no one can guess his real identity?

  • posted by Info
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 6:53pm

And my real identity is???

  • posted by BillPearson
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 7:25pm

You slay me info. I keep trying to have legitimate discussions but you refuse to even have a straight forward dialogue. Then you say stuff like this:

quote:


I have never understood greed


And then to top it off, you praddle on about what UFCW leaders make. Geez, how dumb can you be? I don't even mean that as an insult.

I did a post on slaveway where i broke down the average wage of the 1.4 million members of the UFCW. I was very generous and projected they made on average $14. I also gave them the benefit of the doubt and said they worked 40 hours a week (in reality the wage is probably closer to $12 and the hours more in the range of 30-35).

Taking my high side numbers still equated to less than $30,000 a year. For comparison i added the ridiculous wages of several UFCW leaders making $200,000, $300,000, $400,000 and even old fat Jack at $500,000 a year. That meant we had guys making in a month what their members were making in a year.

Don't you find something wrong with that? Especially given their miserable performance of late. These guys have failed their membership. The ship is sinking and they are grabbing every dime they can steal. If you wanna get into detail, i'd be happy to.

Hell, look at Dority and his walkaway money. He was making $326,000 a year, has a pension of $170,000 plus and they gave him a half a million dollar bonus...and he led the UFCW to the brink of collapse.

When is too much too much? When do you quit pretending this shit is okay? I lived, ate, slept and breathed union, but i'm sick of what these guys have done to and for workers. How do you possibly turn a blind eye to it?

  • posted by Info
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:00pm

I am not saying what they are doing is okay, what I am saying is I am not going to let it get me angry.I choose rather to live my life in a way that sets an example rather than living a life where I spend all my time pointing at others saying that is wrong.I know at times I fail at this but sometimes to see others pointing the fingers at others all the time gets annoying.

The other thing is I look at other things such as numbers tonight at work a fellow co-worker and I were discussing out local president's wage and it worked out to one weeks dues from the members, when you look at things that way it is not much money out of my pocket.

By the way my compliments on your home page as I was going over it and reading some of the posts the thought occured to me that I should start trying to get my local to invest in something like that, so now I have a little project for myself thanks.

  • posted by hellraiser
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:01pm

quote:


posted by Richard:
Is Info trying to sound illiterate so that no one can guess his real identity?


Nice catch Richard. The slide has been noticeable. I'm kinda disappointed he hasn't been playing the religious dolt lately. I helped him try to create that persona and now he's abandoned it. Ungracious fuck. Sorry Info, I'm more mad at myself. I guess that list of scriptures ran out, and you've now let the sinful side takeover... becoming an angry poster. You is wanna be me. I was right. The little mongoloid brother I never had.

I kinda wanna trade Info for DIY. More manly, big brain, means big head. DIY... meet you at Woody's this weekend? In the back by the glory holes. Info doesn't know what he's missing.

  • posted by Info
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:06pm

I was just about to say good night then I see I am letting you down isdu so here is your scripture for tonight and it is one that seems to be my frame of mind for this evening.
1Timothy 6:8 So, having sustenance and covering, we shall be content with these things.

Maybe another time we can discuss the scriptual view of the going ons at woodys sailor bar.

  • posted by hellraiser
  • Mon, Jan 10, 2005 8:37pm

quote:


posted by Info:
1Timothy 6:8 So, having sustenance and covering, we shall be content with these things.

Maybe another time we can discuss the scriptual view of the going ons at woodys sailor bar.


Info, too little too late. We could've been content together... a little JD-coke sustenance and some coverings. If we went bare-back you wouldn't even need those. We would've been better than scripture!! Alas, I gotta now hope on DIY to make your scripture meaningful.

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